Hey guys.

Considering either getting GT40 (P) heads, or having my factory E7's serviced.

I need to get LPG Seats, and tidy the exhaust up a little on the E7s if I go that way. I can get GT40P heads already serviced (not LPG) for $750 a pair.

Going into an EL, with EL GT Headers.

Whats my best approach here for simplicity? - Can I use the GT40P's and still change the plugs with the EL GT Headers, or am i best of just getting the E7's tickled.

Who does the best work like that in Brisbane or the Gold Coast?

Nigel

Any factory unleaded head does not need any other work done to it to run LPG.
Dont get sucked into the trap. An unleaded head has hardened seats anyway which is exactly what LPG needs.

I'd think he'd be aware of that since he's been running LPG vehicles for a lot of years.

In the case of the Falcon 4.0 OHC I6's, that would be a safe bet - I know of a fair few ex-taxi's that have done 900 000+ km's on LPG with the engine/head untouched.

Unfortunately with some jap commuter vehicles used as cab's, some that are designed to run on unleaded fail badly on LPG with the heads, so not all are equal.

You'd think the Falcon V8's would be like the OHC I6's - be interested in his answer.

The primary questions here are :
1. E7 Heads or GT40Ps on EL GT Extractors - with easy servicing?
2. E7 Head Servicing in Brisbane - whos good at it for a good price.

About LPG :

Ive run LPG for 23 years now - on Ford I6 and V8 Engines. So yeah, telling me it isnt needed both isnt what I was after, nor is it helpfull to others.
Most Alloy Heads already have inserts to stop VSR. Thats mostly good enough for LPG
Interestingly, most ULP Cast Iron Heads have inserts on the exhaust valves. That helps. They often dont though - and are simply hardened in the seat area.
Cast Iron Heads often have Seat Recession problems on the Inlet Valve. I was reading recently that its often because design decisions include the entire fuel system. For example, you can use cheaper inlet valves because the Injector cools the back of the valce with fuel (which doesnt happen on LPG).
Apparently often a car thats converted after its been run on petrol for a while will last longer, because the running on petrol actually work hardens the seat before LPG has a chance to screw it up.
Now the problem with all of that is : If I get the heads services, I lose work hardening.

For reference, Holden V6 commo engines (VN, VR) were known to have issues with VSR - and if you converted them to LPG you would often pop a valve through into the water jacket eventually. My 5.0 is of a similar vintage.
As Im putting the 5.0 into a good EL i6 body, I intend to do good amounts of KMs so Id really like not to worry about seat recessoin in the first instance.

I know I can get around some of the VSR problem using a flashlube system. But if we are servicing heads we can look at inserts anyway for not a lot of $$

Nigel

Well I have also run LPG for numerous years as well.
You stated you needed LPG seats while asking for a place that will do them for a good price. I responded based on that. No I didn't answer all your questions but I did answer one. The reply received from you to be told it was of no help is rubbish.
I'm starting to think most of you guys getting in and around their 50's are suffering from male menopause. All patronizing a***hole.

Good post Nigel - I used to think ULP engines would run LPG long term, but not all are equal.

After reading this I'm glad I don't have my apparent periods any more - I'd get upset with any little thing that happens.

Probably best to go the inserts - it's debatable whether Flashlube works or not - there's a train of thought that the flashlube simply burns in the combustion chamber, unlike the lead in leaded petrol. Not sure if there's any proof out there showing the benefits of flashlube.
So the cast iron windsor E7's,GT40's, etc have no existing inserts ???

As best as I can read, the Cast heads are induction hardened at the factory. Ive nothing anywhere on the net mentioning factory inserts in E7's or GT-p's

Actually
http://www.sbintl.com/tech7.html
Was interesting reading - especially the two bits about Leaded engines being converted to ULP, and then having head services...
.. and the bit about Induction hardening, and how it often isnt deep enough for a re-co.

Ive heard good things about flashlube, except the price. its a high flashpoint oil so isnt supposed to just burn up, and it does do one thing (lubricate inlet valves) well. Ive also heard that ATF/Dexron is a drop-in replacement

Yeah, the only thing I've seen is a government test from the mid/late 70's comparing a holden/ford/valiant on LPG - being your std cast iron heads for leaded fuel, they suffered valve seat recession/wear and valve hammering.
Pete (XR9UTE) might know more on the heads ??

Neither E7's nor GT40P's had inserts. I traded an AU 5.0 that was run on LPG in a taxi. 420k's on the clock. Unknown LPG k's. But the exhaust valves were all receeded into the head a good 5mm, maybe slightly more. I've build petrol 5.0's with E7 and GT40P heads that have done 600k's plus. The seats only needed a hand lap.

This may have been a one off where the induction hardening wasn't sufficient, or maybe it is representative of GT40P heads. I don't know. But I would definately go with inserts.

E7's flow poorly, maxing out around 300HP if the engine combination is perfectly optimised. GT40P's are much better. But for what you are going to end up spending, I would go for a set of aftermarket heads. Not much more cost for a whole lot more benefit.

Yep .. Look around for some Edelbock, RHS or Holley heads...
http://performanceparts.com/part/Edelbr ... emobile=no
I wouldn't spend 1c on E7's...

Guys that completely wasnt the question (aftermarket's) - I dont have $2k. I can get GT40Ps reco already for $750, and about the same for the E7's.

I dont have much more than that right now

Nigel

You already said your were going to spend about this much

GT40P = $750
Hardened valve seats = $300
Basic Porting = $400
Total = $1450

In NZ I can get brand new alloy heads (not chinese crap) for NZ$1900, so I would expect the price to be somewhat lower in Aussie. Maybe $1600-$1700?

So like I said, for not much more ($150-$250) you get a much better outcome

To make the E7's work well, expect to spend around 40 hours porting. So that's over $2k unless you do it yourself

GT40P's usually only need 6-8 hours work. But header fitment can be problematic