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| jumpingjak |
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holly crap, sum mechanics are usless and dont realy hear what you tell them, this one guy trys to tell me it might be playing up because i got the abs, pats and command center off.. wtf, also trys to say his scan tool might not work properly because things have been dissabled, hmmm ok then, to take the icing off the cake his trying to tell me it could be wires in the engine loom that i did not even touch, I think i will go out and check the throttle body plugs to pcm for any open or bad circuits just for the hell of it. I cant help but think its the pcm tho. I checked my 8peddle wires and they all go to the right pcm (b) pins, my powers and earths all go to the right (b) pins aswell, thats all i need to make the throttle work. The rest of the circuit runs thru the pcm and gose to (a) plug and the throttle body. When the peddle moves the pcm sensors that, and also sensors the position of the butterfly, then determains how much voltage to send thru the motor to move the butterfly with the peddle movment.
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| jumpingjak |
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I been checking the pcm pins for resistances, mostly the peddle, throttle body, and thorttle body motor. I cheacked the 5v and earth pins for the peddle and i was getting about 53k ohms. I also checked the throttle body 5v and earth pins and im getting a huge 2.5M ohms. from memory v/r = I, need my electronic calculator to work these out.. Voltage devided by current time resisstance.. if you are missing 1of them you can use the other 2 to work out the missing1.. So here we have a voltage and ressistance, no current.. Voltage devided by the resistance will give you the current.. Il work them out and post up what i get.
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| jumpingjak |
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okidoki my calculator sez that 5v/53k ohms has a current flow of about 94.3mha.
5v/2.5m ohm has a current flow of about 0.002mha, hmmm? dosent quiet seem right. rod mate, you brought back sum memories of the old oscilloscope and now i have to try and find a cheap one on gumtree  I should be able to work out abit more with one of them, but the 0.002mha dose not seem right and that reading is between the thorttle body snesor a21(5v) and a22(earth). Were as between the throttle pedle sensors voltage and earth, b45(5v) and b21(earth) im getting 5v at 94.3mha which seem about right.
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| rod hansen |
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What's the voltages with the key on with out touching the throttle have you got at b17 b18 b19 b20 b45 b33 b21 '''' a44 a22 a16 a21.
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| jumpingjak |
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im getting 6v reading, which is weired coz its a 5v ref. I have them pin read outs aswell. Im going to bring my loom back onto the table and power it up to check my 5v ref pins and the earths
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| rod hansen |
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Is that from the throttle position sensor's on the throttle body and the accelerator pedal, or the throttle motor. If it is from the sensor's you have a problem.
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| jumpingjak |
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The 6v is at the motor. I did not get a chance to get my loom out the car but tomorrow the weather is spoze to be ok so tonight i spent time on learning how the drive by wire works. tomorrow il power up the pcm and check my reff voltages, earth and sig pins on the throttle body and the pedle.. What i learnt is when you move the pedle one voltage gose from 5v to 0v and the other voltage is opposite it gose from 0v to 5v, that is spose to be sum kind of safty thing so the pcm can verify its getting the right info from the pedle, then the pcm sends a voltage to the motor telling it to open the butterfly to the angle of the pedle, at the same time the butterfly position sensor gives a certain resistance to feed back a certain voltage to the pcm which should match the pedle. I think because my signals are not matching the pcm keeps trying to correct the problem and its kind of looping and the throttle motor shutters instead of activating. Maybe. I could be totaly wrong,
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| rod hansen |
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You should not have 5 and 0 that would mean no voltage has been dropped across the wiper, 4 volts down to 1 and 1 volt to 4 on the switch on the throttle body, and the same on sensor 1 and 2 on the accelerator pedal and sensor 3, is 1 volt to 4 volts that's why I want you to check all the pins with the key on. You tell me what you have, and I will hook up my scan tool on my car and check the pids also there is another pid that say's no pedal and part pedal when you touch the throttle.
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| jumpingjak |
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ahh ok, ye i did not think these kind of systems went down to 0v. ahh k 1v to4v and 4v to 1v. Im just getting ready to go out and get some readings so i should have some stuff posted up in a hr or so, Ill just start of with some simple volt reading from my v reff pins on the pcm, if my v reff pins are ok ill go ahead and check the plugs to see if the v reff voltages are making it to them.
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| jumpingjak |
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here is what my multimeter red to me, i unpluged my pedle and throttle body, then powered up the pcm, I also took my reading from the pedle and throttle body plugs. Not the pcm plugs.
PEDLE PLUG VREFF 7-3=5v, 6-1=5v WIPERS 2-3=4.85v, 2-7=0v, 5-7=4.84v, 5-3=0v, 8-6=4.87v, 8-1=0v THROTTLE BODY PLUG VREFF 2-3=5v (when i 1st put the multimeter on it red 9.5v,wow. re-tested and red 5v) WIPERS 1-2=0v, 1-3=4.84v, 4-3=0v, 4-2=4.84v MOTOR PLUG reads 0v.. When i plug the pedle and throttle body back up then power up the pcm i get 6v across the motor plug, no change in volts with pedle movment, and if i plug the motor plug back on then power up the pcm it just makes the shutter sound |
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| jumpingjak |
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I found a realy good utube thing about the drive by wire, Its explained realy well on how it works...
Its called, Drive by wire training... by Wells VE... |
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| rod hansen |
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Mate you have a problem, your wipers should not be at zero volts, that is a good video from well's but our throttle body motors are run by frequency and duty cycle. I hooked up two frequency and duty cycle meters to either side of the throttle body motor and at 18% of throttle opening it reverses to the opposite side of the motor, and as soon as you back off the throttle it reverses and so on. Don't forget this throttle body I.C inside the pcm is hooked up to your abs, tcm, and speed sensor. I thought I read in one of your posts you connected battery voltage to b7, I thought the pcm transmitted a square wave out of b7.
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| jumpingjak |
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aslo the the 4.85volts should only be at about 4volts ay? the 1volt i should be getting is the voltage drop across the resisstor in the pedle is that right? maybe because the pedle was not pluged in there was no voltage drop and that also why in getting 4.85volt. Im going to try plugging every thing in exept the throttle motor then back probe my plugs to see what readings i get. Im still trying to find a cheap oscilloscope. you think a 25mhz scope should be ok for reading the car?
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| jumpingjak |
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I think i have found a problem.. Here are my readings with every thing pluged up exept the throttle motor..
PEDEL: 2-3=4.02v, 2-7=0.98v, 5-7=3.55v, 5-3=1.5v, 8-6=4.05v, 8-1=0.96v.. THROTTLE SENSOR: 1-2=3.93v, 1-3=1.1v, 4-3=4.17v, 4-2=0.85v.. THROTTLE MOTOR: a27-a28=6v.. The throttle sensor is reading the opposite voltage on the pins to what it did when it was unpluged.. Other than that when i move the pedle the 2voltages go up and down smoothly to the volts there spose to. Same with the throttle body sensor, as i move the butterfly the volts change like there spose to smoothly. |
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| jumpingjak |
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Do you guys know what the resistance of the throttle motor should be? also if eny1 know the resistance across the motor plug?
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